>> Announcer: PRODUCTION FUNDING FOR "QED WITH DR. B.î IS PROVIDED BY -- AMERICAN ELECTRIC POWER FOUNDATION.

BOUNDLESS ENERGY FOR BRIGHTER FUTURES.

AND BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

THANK YOU.

>> I'M DR. FREDERIC BERTLEY, IMMUNOLOGIST AND EDUCATOR.

SCIENCE IS EVERYWHERE AND FOR EVERY ONE.

AND IT'S ALL AROUND US, SHAPING OUR LIVES EVERY SINGLE DAY.

IN THIS SERIES, WE'LL LOOK AT CUTTING EDGE RESEARCH, TALK TO THE SCIENTISTS WHO ARE CHARTING NEW FRONTIERS AND SOLVING TODAY'S PROBLEMS TO MAKE ALL OUR LIVES BETTER.

WHEN A SCIENTIST OR MATHEMATICIAN DEMONSTRATES PROOF OF CONCEPT IN THEIR WORK, THEY OFTEN USE A TERM "Q.E.D."

QUAD ERAT DEMONSTRANDUM.

THAT ROUGHLY TRANSLATES TO QUITE EASILY DEMONSTRATED.

WELCOME TO "QED WITH DR.

B."

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>>> WELCOME TO COSI AND THE CENTER OF SCIENCE MINISTRY, VOTED THE NUMBER ONE SCIENCE MUSEUM IN THE NATION BY ìUSA TODAY.î OF COURSE WE'RE ON WITH ìQED WITH DR. B.î IN PARTNERSHIP WITH OUR FAMOUS FANTASTIC PARTNER, WOSU.

COULDN'T BE HAPPIER TO HAVE YOU HERE PRODUCER DIANA IS GONNA BE WITH US TODAY ON THE SHOW.

AND TODAY IS THE SCIENCE OF TASTE.

AND WE HAVE NONE OTHER THAN THE NATIONAL PHENOM JENNI BRITTON BAUER, FOUNDER AND CEO OF JENNI'S ICE CREAM.

JENNI, THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US TODAY.

>> HEY!

IT'S SO GREAT TO BE HERE.

>> YOU GOT INTO THE ICE CREAM KIND OF THROUGH THE ART SCENE, BUT YOU'VE DEFINITELY LEVERAGED SCIENCE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAXIMIZE HOW TO TAKE TWO, OR THREE, OR FIVE DIFFERENT FLAVORS TOGETHER TO BLEND THIS CREAMY, RICH, INCREDIBLE PRODUCT THAT WE ALL LOVE.

HOW DO YOU DO IT?

TALK TO US ABOUT THE SCIENCE OF THIS.

>> WELL, YOU'RE RIGHT.

I DID COME THROUGH ART.

IN FACT, I REJECTED SCIENCE FOR MY ENTIRE LIFE.

I THOUGHT I WAS TERRIBLE AT IT.

AND IT TURNS OUT, IF YOU WANT TO MAKE SOMETHING, AND I MEAN ICE CREAM TO ART, YOU REALLY DO HAVE TO KNOW A LITTLE BIT ABOUT SCIENCE.

AND THAT'S MAYBE MY WAY IN WAS THROUGH ICE CREAM.

SO, I WANTED TO BRING THESE BEAUTIFUL FLAVORS TO LIFE AND MAKE THEM REALLY POP.

AND ONE OF THE WAYS WE DO THAT IS BY NOT USING STABILIZERS AND EMULSIFIERS WHICH ARE THICKENERS THAT PEOPLE USE IN ICE CREAM.

BUT, THEY CAN ACTUALLY CREATE A BARRIER BETWEEN TASTE ON YOUR TONGUE.

AND SO, WE WORK WITH MILK PROTEINS TO KIND OF MAKE MILK PROTEINS ACT THAT WAY.

AND WHAT YOU GET IS THIS REALLY PURE POP OF FLAVOR.

SO, THAT'S ONE THING.

ANOTHER THING THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT IS HOW IT MELTS.

WE'RE VERY AWARE OF HOW THE ICE CREAM IS GONNA MELT ON YOUR TONGUE AND BLOOM ALL THAT FLAVOR INTO YOUR NOSE.

SO, WE MAKE ICE CREAM -- I WOULD SAY I MAKE ICE CREAM TO BE LICKED.

OR, YOU KNOW, JUST EATEN DIRECTLY OUT OF A PINT.

>> SO, LET ME ASK YOU.

SO, A -- YOU FIGURE OUT HOW YOU WANT TO COMBINE FLAVORS CHEMICALLY, BUT THEN THERE'S A SECOND LAYER OF HOW THEY COMBINE AND ACTUALLY MELT IN YOUR MOUTH AND GET ANOTHER EITHER AROMATIC OR A SECONDARY KIND OF FLAVOR PROFILE.

AND YOU PUT ALL THE TOGETHER BY UNDERSTANDING SCIENCE?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

AND IT REALLY DOES GO BACK TO HOW THE ICE CREAM MELTS.

I MEAN, IT'S HOW WE'RE PUTTING IN THERE, YOU KNOW, OF WHATEVER FLAVORING INGREDIENT IT IS.

AND SOMETIMES WE NEED, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING LIKE MINT IS GOING TO BE LIKE STEEPING AND ACTUALLY INFUSING THE BUTTER FAT.

THAT'S FAT THAT'S IN ALL MILK, THAT'S IN MILK AND CREAM.

INFUSING THAT WITH A SCENT.

BECAUSE FLAVOR, ACTUALLY MOST OF IT'S ACTUALLY SCENT.

AND SO, YOU'RE GONNA INFUSE THE BUTTER FAT WITH SCENT.

SOME FLAVORS LIKE STRAWBERRIES ARE ACTUALLY VERY HIGH IN WATER.

AND ACTUALLY, THE SCENT IS A WATER SOLUBLE SCENT.

SO, IT IS WATER THAT'S GONNA KIND OF SCENT THE WATER THAT'S ALREADY IN MILK TOO.

MILK IS 87% WATER.

BUT, IT'S REALLY COOL BECAUSE WATER TURNS TO ICE AND ICE CRYSTALS IN ICE CREAM, RIGHT?

SO, YOU HAVE TO COUNTER THAT ON THE OTHER SIDE MOLECULARLY, OR ELSE YOU GET REALLY ICY ICE CREAM.

SO, IT IS ALL ABOUT THIS VERY DELICATE BALANCE OF HOW YOU PUT EVERY INGREDIENT TOGETHER TO REALLY MAKE IT POP.

>>> THAT'S SO FANTASTIC.

LISTEN, WE HAVE YOU HERE ALL SHOW AND WE'RE EXCITED.

WE'RE GONNA COME BACK TO A FEW THINGS.

BUT FIRST, I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE SCIENCE BEHIND HOW WE TASTE AND THIS MIND-BODY CONNECTION.

AND FOR THAT, WE'RE GOING TO DR. DANA SMALL, PROFESSOR OF PSYCHIATRY AND PSYCHOLOGY AT THE YALE SCHOOL OF MEDICINE.

>>> FROM AN EVOLUTIONARY PROSPECTIVE, WHY DO WE EVEN HAVE THE SENSE OF TASTE?

>> IT'S ACTUALLY A REALLY GREAT QUESTION.

BUT, FIRST WE HAVE TO START WITH MAKING SURE WE'RE ON THE SAME PAGE WITH WHAT WE MEAN BY TASTE.

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SO, IF YOU ASK SOMEONE LIKE ME, A CHEMOSENSORY SCIENTIST, WHAT I MEAN BY TASTE IS SWEET, SOUR, SALTY, BITTER, OR SAVORY.

IF YOU ASKED SOMEBODY FROM THE GENERAL PUBLIC WHAT THEY MEAN BY TASTE, THEY PROBABLY MEAN FLAVOR.

AND FLAVOR IS VERY DIFFERENT FROM TASTE.

SO, FLAVOR IS A MULTISENSORY PERCEPTION THAT IS ACTUALLY MADE IN THE BRAIN.

SO, FLAVOR IS MADE OF THE TASTE INPUTS, THE SMELL INPUTS, AND THE SOMATOSENSORY INPUTS.

AND THERE'S IN FACT DIFFERENT EVOLUTIONARY PRESSURES TO CREATE THE SENSE OF TASTE COMPARED TO FLAVOR.

>> SO, WHAT IS THE EVOLUTIONARY BENEFIT TO THE SENSE OF TASTE?

>> TASTE, LIKE SWEET, SOUR, SALTY, BITTER, AND SAVORY EVOLVE TO IDENTIFY NUTRIENTS AND ENERGY IN OUR FOODS.

AS WELL AS SPOILAGE AND MOST IMPORTANTLY TOXINS.

SO, MOST SUBSTANCES THAT ARE POISONOUS HAVE A BITTER TASTE.

SO, IF WE TAKE BITTER TASTE, THEY'RE AREN'T MANY THINGS IN THE WORLDS THAT ARE POISONOUS.

AND THE STRUCTURE OF THE CHEMICALS ARE VERY DIFFERENT.

SO, WE EVOLVED MANY DIFFERENT TYPES OF BITTER RECEPTORS TO BE ABLE TO RECOGNIZE ALL THOSE DIFFERENT POISONS.

BUT, WHEN WE SENSE THEM, IT PRODUCES SORT OF A SINGULAR PERCEPTION WHICH IS BITTER.

AND WE'RE BORN DISLIKING BITTER FOR A GOOD REASON.

WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO LEARN THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN BITTER AND POISON BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE RATHER PERILOUS FOR ANY ORGANISM.

AND SWEET IS JUST THE OPPOSITE.

SO, WHENEVER WE SENSE SOMETHING SWEET, IT GENERALLY MEANS THERE'S SUGAR PRESENT.

THE MORE SWEET SOMETHING IS, THE MORE SUGAR IS PRESENT.

SO, WE'RE BORN LIKING SWEET TASTE BECAUSE ALL ORGANISMS HAVE TO ACQUIRE ENERGY IN ORDER TO SURVIVE.

>> IF THIS IS AN HARDWIRE EVOLUTIONARY CHARACTERISTIC TRAIT FOR US, IN NATURE, HOW COME THERE HASN'T BEEN AN EVOLUTION FOR POISONOUS STUFF TO TASTE SWEET?

>> WELL, YEAH.

SO, IT'S TRUE THAT WE'RE NOT THE ONLY ORGANISM LIFEFORM EVOLVING.

YEAH.

AND THERE'S DEFINITELY POISONS THAT DO TASTE SWEET.

AND IN FACT, THAT'S SORT OF WHERE FLAVOR COMES IN.

FLAVOR PREFERENCES UNLIKE TASTE ARE LEARNED.

AND THEY ARE LEARNED BY PAIRING SENSORY EXPERIENCE WITH A PHYSIOLOGICAL EXPERIENCE LIKE FEELING ILL OR NAUSEOUS.

OR, UNCONSCIOUS SIGNALS ACTUALLY THAT ARE GENERATED WHEN WE METABOLIZE FOOD.

THAT TELL ARE CELLS THAT THERE'S ENERGY PRESENT AND OUR CELLS ARE ABLE TO GET THAT ENERGY.

THEY SEND A SIGNAL TO THE BRAIN THAT TELLS US THAT THE FOOD IS GOOD.

SO, IF WE TAKE LIKE A BERRY WHICH CAN BE SWEET BUT POISONOUS.

THAT BERRY IS NOT JUST SWEET, IT HAS A BERRY TASTE.

AND THAT BERRY TASTE IS NOT TASTE AT ALL.

IT'S ACTUALLY FLAVOR.

AND IT'S COMING FROM THE OLFACTORY SYSTEM.

THE TASTE PART IS SWEETNESS.

MAYBE A TINY BIT OF BITTER.

AND THE SMELL PART IS BERRY.

AND THAT COMES WHEN YOU CHEW IT.

THE VOLATILES IN YOUR MOUTH FROM CHEWING THE SUBSTANCE ACTUALLY GO FROM THE ORAL CAVITY TO THE NASAL CAVITY.

AND IN THE NOSE, THOSE VOLATILES BIND TO RECEPTORS IN A PLACE CALLED THE OLFACTORY EPITHELIUM.

AND THEN WE PERCEIVE BERRY.

I THINK THE MOST INTERESTING IMPLICATION OF THESE FINDINGS IS ACTUALLY FOR PREVENTION AND UNDERSTANDING THE MODERN FOOD ENVIRONMENT.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT PROCESSED FOODS, YOU HAVE ALL KINDS OF WEIRD COMBINATIONS OF SENSATION THAT ARE NO LONGER RELATED TO THE NUTRITIVE PROPERTIES.

AND THE SYSTEM REALLY GETS MESSED UP.

AND SOME OF THE WORK IN MY LAB HAS SHOWN THAT WHEN YOU CONSUME EVEN SMALL AMOUNTS OF FOODS THAT ARE LIKE THIS, SORT OF MISMATCHED, YOU CAN DEVELOP VERY RAPIDLY INSULIN RESISTANCE.

AND YOUR BRAIN RESPONSE CHANGES.

AND SO, THIS WHOLE PRINCIPAL THAT IT'S REALLY THE METABOLIC SIGNALS THAT SORT OF DERIVING REWARD.

AND THINKING ABOUT THE MODERN FOOD ENVIRONMENT, ONE OF THE FUNDAMENTAL REASONS WHY WE HAVE AN OBESITY AND DIABETES PANDEMIC ON OUR HANDS.

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>>> WE'RE GONNA MAKE SOME ICE CERAM OF OUR OWN.

A CUP OF SUGAR.

FOLLOWED BY FIVE CUPS OF HALF AND HALF WHIPPED CREAM.

FOLLOWED BY ABOUT A THIRD OF A CUP OF GLUCOSE LIQUID SUGAR.

FOLLOWED BY WHATEVER THE FLAVOR YOU'RE USING.

IN THIS CASE, WE'RE USING VANILLA.

ONCE YOU FEEL LIKE ALL THE PARTICLES HAVE DISSOLVED, THEN YOU ADD YOUR LIQUID NITROGEN.

NOW, THE COOL THING HERE IS WHAT THE LIQUID NITROGEN DOES.

NOW, LIQUID NITROGEN IS -320 FAHRENHEIT.

SPEEDS UP THE PROCESS.

YOU CAN MAKE YOUR ICE CREAM IN A MINUTE, TO YOU KNOW, TWO MINUTES TOPS.

THE OTHER COOL THING ABOUT THE LIQUID NITROGEN IS IT FREEZES SO QUICKLY THAT YOU GET THESE TINY CRYSTALS INSTEAD OF THESE BIG CRYSTALS.

AND THAT'S ONE OF THE SECRETS THAT MAKES THE ICE CREAM REALLY CREAMY, SMOOTH, AND JUST WITHOUT THAT CRYSTAL FLAVOR.

>> WOW.

>> OH, WOW.

YEAH.

UM-HMM.

MM-MM.

YUMMY YUMMY.

>> SO JENNI, CLEARLY WE USE LIQUID NITROGEN, -300 DEGREES FAHRENHEIT TO MAKE THIS ICE CREAM QUICKLY.

BUT, WHAT'S THE OPTIMAL TEMPERATURE TO MAKE ICE CREAM IN GENERAL AND YOUR ICE CREAM?

>> WELL, THE OPTIMAL TEMPERATURE IS VERY, VERY COLD.

NOT FAR FROM WHAT YOU'RE DOING WITH LIQUID NITROGEN.

THE WAY THAT I THINK ABOUT IT ACTUALLY IS ALSO WHAT TEMPERATURE DO WE WANT TO EXTRUDE IT AT?

SO, THAT'S ABOUT 15 DEGREES.

BUT, NOT ONLY IS IT FROZEN, THE ICE CRYSTALS ARE TUMBLED AND THE RIGHT EXACT AMOUNT OF AIR IS WHIPPED IN.

AIR IS IMPORTANT AND THE BEST WAY TO THINK OF IT IS THIS.

IF YOU JUST TOOK A, YOU KNOW, YOUR CREAM, AND SUGAR, AND ANY OTHER INGREDIENTS AND FROZE IT AS IS, IT WOULD BE LIKE A BRICK.

RIGHT?

AIR IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE IT MAKES IT LUSH, AND CREAMY, AND SCOOPABLE.

AIR IS ACTUALLY REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT IN ICE CREAM FOR THAT REASON ACTUALLY.

MAKES IT TASTE CREAMIER.

>> OKAY.

>> MAKES IT MELT IN THE PERFECT WAY ON YOUR TONGUE.

>> THAT IS ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING.

>> AIR IS AN INGREDIENT IN ICE CREAM IF YOU CAN IMAGINE.

>> SO, JENNI YOU'VE SAID THAT ICE CREAM IS THAT PERFECT NEUTRAL BASE FOR TASTING FLAVORS.

WHY IS THAT?

>> WELL, A WHOLE BUNCH OF REALLY COOL REASONS.

I MEAN, OF COURSE THE FLAVOR OF CREAM IS JUST BEAUTIFUL.

IT'S LIKE A LUSH BACKDROP FOR ANYTHING THAT YOU WANT TO PUT ON TOP OF IT.

BUT, MORE SPECIFICALLY AND FROM A SCIENCE POINT OF VIEW, BUTTER FAT MELTS TWO DEGREES BELOW BODY TEMPERATURE.

NOT ALL FATS ARE LIKE THAT.

THEY ALL HAVE DIFFERENT MELTING POINTS.

AND SO, YOU CAN LOAD IT WITH SCENT AND FLAVOR.

LOCK IT IN IN THE FREEZING PROCESS.

AND THE MOMENT IT HITS YOUR TONGUE, THE WARMTH OF YOUR BODY, IT RELAXES AND VOLATILIZES ALL OF THE SCENT INTO YOUR HEAD.

YOU KNOW?

AND THAT'S WHERE YOU GET THAT SCENT.

AND AS YOU LICK, IT CONTINUES TO BUILD.

SO, IT'S THIS BEAUTIFUL WAY OF EXPERIENCING FLAVOR AND ALL OF THE BOUNTY THAT GROWS ON EARTH.

>> I LOVE THAT.

AND WHAT I LOVE ABOUT JENNI'S ICE CREAM IS THAT NO MATTER WHAT FLAVOR OF ICE CREAM I TASTE, I KNOW IT'LL BE DELICIOUS.

RIGHT, FREDERIC?

>> RIGHT.

I CAN ATTEST TO THAT.

ABSOLUTELY.

SENSATION AND PERCEPTION ARE SO IMPORTANT WHEN YOU CHOOSE WHAT TO EAT.

DR. CHRISTOPHER SIMONS AT THE DEPARTMENT OF FOOD AND SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY AT THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY DOES JUST THAT.

HE LOOKS AT SENSATION AND PERCEPTION AND HOW THAT IMPACTS OUR CHOICES.

>>> WE LOVE SALTY FOOD.

WE LOVE FATTY FOOD.

WE LOVE SUGARY FOOD.

BUT, WE ALSO KNOW THAT, ESPECIALLY IN SIGNIFICANT AMOUNTS, IT'S NOT NECESSARILY HEALTHY FOR US.

>> RIGHT.

>> HOW CAN WE RETRAIN OUR BRAINS OR OUR OLFACTORY SYSTEM BRAIN, TASTE SYSTEM TO ACTUALLY REALLY LOVE FOOD THAT A LOT OF TIMES ARE VERY HEALTHY FOR US, BUT JUST DON'T TASTE SO GOOD?

>> RIGHT, MAN.

IF I HAD THE ANSWER, I'D BE A MILLIONAIRE.

[ LAUGHTER ] THERE ARE POTENTIALLY WAYS OF TRYING TO OVERCOME SOME OF THESE ISSUES.

SO FOR INSTANCE, ADDING DIFFERENT TYPES OF FLAVOR EXPERIENCES ON TOP, RIGHT?

SO, MAYBE AS YOU REMOVE SALT OR SUGAR, YOU CREATE MORE SORT OF EXOTIC FLAVOR, OLFACTIVE EXPERIENCES, RIGHT?

>> IS THERE NO KIND OF BIOLOGICAL LEARNED OR PHYSIOLOGICAL LEARNED WAY WHERE YOU CAN, YOU KNOW, WHETHER IT'S BROCCOLI -- AND I ACTUALLY LIKE BROCCOLI, BUT BROCCOLI, PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THAT.

YOU KNOW, IS THERE A WAY TO HARDWIRE THAT OR IS IT ALL ABOUT MASKING OF FLAVORS AND TRICKING US TO SAY THIS IS REALLY COOL?

>> SO, YOU MAY HAVE HEARD OF WHAT WE CALL CONDITIONED TASTE AVERSIONS.

WE'VE ALL HAD ONE, RIGHT?

WHEN I WAS LITTLE, I ATE LIKE TWO OR THREE POUNDS OF WHITE CHOCOLATE WITHIN AN HOUR, RIGHT?

GOT VERY SICK.

AND NOW JUST THE THOUGHT OF -- >> CAN'T STAND IT.

>> EXACTLY.

CAN'T EVEN-CAN'T EVEN -- >> MINE IS CREST.

>> CREST?

>> I'LL EMBARRASS MYSELF ON TELEVISION.

I ATE A TUBE OF CREST TOOTHPASTE WHEN I WAS SEVEN.

[ LAUGHTER ] I THOUGHT IT WAS SO DELICIOUS.

SO, TO THIS DAY AS A GROWN MAN I CANNOT BRUSH MY TEETH WITH CREST.

>> YEAH.

RIGHT.

>> IT'S A SITUATION.

>> SO, THE KEY THERE, RIGHT, IS WE BOTH FELT SICK WITHIN A VERY SHORT TIMEFRAME, RIGHT?

SO, IT'S A LEARNED, RIGHT, CONDITION.

TASTE AVERSION.

SO, IN THEORY SOMETHING LIKE THAT COULD HAPPEN WITH HEALTHIER FOODS.

THE PROBLEM IS WITH THESE HEALTHIER FOODS, THE BENEFITS DON'T TYPICALLY HAPPEN UNTIL, YOU KNOW, SOMETIME LATER, RIGHT?

AND SO WE DON'T PAIR THAT FEELING BETTER NECESSARILY WITH THE FOOD.

>> GOT IT.

>> BUT, I THINK THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT WE CAN DO AS WELL.

EVEN BEYOND JUST WHAT WE DO TO THE FOOD.

IN OUR LAB, WE CAN USE IMMERSIVE TECHNOLOGIES.

AND WE HAVE A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT WAYS THAT WE CAN DO THAT.

WE HAVE A BIG VIDEO WALL.

YOU KNOW, WE ALSO HAVE LIKE THE GOGGLES.

THE IMMERSIVE TECHNOLOGY OR THE VIRTUAL REALITY GOGGLES THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S MUCH MORE IMMERSIVE.

WHAT WE'VE REALLY FOUND IS THE PRESENCE OF CONTEXT CHANGES.

IT CHANGES WHAT PEOPLE LIKE.

IT CHANGES WHAT THEY PERCEIVE.

SO, WE'RE ALSO STARTING TO NOW LOOK AT SOCIAL INTERACTIONS NOW OVERLAY ON CONTEXT, RIGHT?

SO, CONTEXT IS ONE VARIABLE THAT WE CAN MANIPULATE.

BUT, NOW WE CAN MANIPULATE WHO YOU'RE EATING WITH, RIGHT?

IS IT A FRIEND?

IS IT A STRANGER?

THOSE THINGS HAVE VERY DIFFERENT EFFECTS, RIGHT?

SO, MAYBE PART OF IT IS TRICKING THE BRAIN AND USING SOME OF THESE FLAVOR, YOU KNOW, NUANCES.

MAYBE SOME OF IT IS WHEN WE'RE MIGRATING INTO THESE HEALTHIER FOODS ENSURING THAT THE ENVIRONMENT IS HAPPY, AND EXCITING, AND PLAYFUL, RIGHT?

AND THAT'S PART OF THE EXPERIENCES IS CONSOLIDATED.

AND SO YOU START TO MAKE THOSE ASSOCIATIONS.

>> SURE.

WHERE IS TASTE GOING?

WHERE IS THIS RESEARCH GOING?

30-50 YEARS FROM NOW?

100 YEARS FROM NOW?

>> SO, I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF REALLY INTERESTING THINGS.

I THINK THAT WE'RE GONNA START TO HAVE PERSONALIZED NUTRITION.

SO, WE ALL HAVE, YOU KNOW, IWATCHES, OR FIT-BITS NOW, RIGHT?

AND SO WE'RE COLLECTING BIOMETRICS ALL THE TIME, RIGHT?

THIS INFORMATION CAN START BEING FED INTO THESE TYPES OF SYSTEMS AND ALGORITHMS THAT CAN START SAY OKAY, THIS IS THE TIME OF DAY WHERE YOU NEED, WHATEVER, VITAMIN-A BECAUSE YOU'RE GETTING TIRED OF WHATEVER IT HAPPENS TO BE.

I THINK THE TECHNOLOGY IS TERMS OF FOOD DESIGN ALSO WILL START TO ENABLE THAT.

YOU KNOW, WE START TO HAVE 3D PRINTING OF FOODS, RIGHT?

SO, NOW YOU CAN EVEN ENVISION WHERE YOU GO HOME AND, YOU KNOW, OKAY, ACCORDING MY BIOMETRICS I NEED FORMULA C IN A, SOMETHING THAT LOOKS LIKE A STEAK.

BEEP-BEEP-BEEP, RIGHT?

>> LIKE ìSTAR TREK?î >> YES, EXACTLY.

EXACTLY RIGHT.

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I THERE'S ALSO A LOT OF INTEREST IN HOW WE CAN LEVERAGE THIS INFORMATION IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF BETTER TASTING FRUITS AND VEGETABLES.

YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE PROBLEMS, PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THE TASTE OF WHOLE WHEAT, RIGHT?

AND SO, IF PEOPLE ATE MORE WHOLE WHEAT BREADS AND SO FORTH THEY'D BE A LOT HEALTHIER.

BUT, YOU KNOW, SO FEW PEOPLE ACTUALLY EAT IT.

SO, WE CAN START TO IDENTIFY COMPOUNDS THAT CONTRIBUTE TO EITHER THE LIKING OR THE DISLIKING OF THOSE BREADS.

WE CAN START TO LINK WITH HORTICULTURISTS AND CROP SCIENTISTS AND START TO UNDERSTAND, OKAY, WHAT ARE THE METABOLIC PATHWAYS THAT ARE CAUSING THE INCREASE OR DECREASE OF THESE PARTICULAR PRODUCTS?

AND HOW WE CAN ACTUALLY THEN START TO BREED CROPS TO HAVE MORE HIGHER QUALITY SENSORY CHARACTERISTICS?

>> SO GENE THERAPY FOR GOOD TASTING FOOD?

>> EXACTLY.

AND WE KNOW WE CAN USE GENE THERAPY TO BREED CROPS TO HAVE A BETTER SENSORY PROFILE.

SO, NOW THAT WE'VE MAXIMIZED THE EFFICIENCY OF THE CROPS, NOW LET'S FOCUS ON THESE OTHER ASPECTS THAT WE CAN ACTUALLY DELIVER FOODS THAT PEOPLE WANT TO EAT.

>> SURE.

>> BECAUSE THEY ACTUALLY ARE TASTY.

>> BUT, IT SOUNDS LIKE RIGHT NOW WE CAN'T PERFECTLY ENGINEER THE COMBINATION OF BEST TASTING WITH HEALTHIEST FOODS.

WE CAN SOCIALLY ENGINEER THE KIND OF ATMOSPHERE CONTEXT AROUND US TO MAYBE ALLOW US TO ENJOY MUCH MORE EATING SOME FOODS THAT MIGHT NOT TASTE AS GREAT, BUT ARE REALLY NUTRITIONALLY VALUABLE AND HEALTHY TO US?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> IS THAT CORRECT?

>> I THINK THAT THAT'S A BIG PIECE OF IT, RIGHT?

SO, IF WE CAN'T MAKE THE PERFECT FOOD, LET'S MAKE EVERYTHING ELSE AROUND THAT FOOD AS OPTIMAL AS WE CAN.

THE EXPERIENCE, THE PEOPLE.

ALL OF THOSE OTHER CONTEXTUAL ELEMENTS THAT ARE PART OF THAT PROCESS, PART OF THE EXPERIENCE OF ENJOYING FOODS.

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>>> SO JENNI, YOU'RE NATIONALLY KNOWN.

YOU ACTUALLY SHIP YOUR GREAT PRODUCT THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRE COUNTRY.

WHAT CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT HOW YOU PACKAGE YOUR PRODUCT TO MAKE SURE THE END USER 500, 1,000 MILES AWAY GETS A GREAT PRODUCT?

>> OUR PACKAGING IS COMPLETELY MOISTURE PROOF.

AND SO, WE WORK HARD SO YOU'RE NOT GETTING THAT SORT OF EXCHANGE OF FLAVORS GOING IN AND OUT OF THE PACKAGE SO WHEN WE PUT IT IN THERE, IT STAYS THERE.

AND THAT'S REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT.

>> IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT THE PACKAGING THAT YOU'VE FIGURED OUT MAKES THE ICE CREAM TASTE EXACTLY HOW IT TASTED WHEN YOU MADE IT TO A WEEK OR MONTH LATER WHEN SOMEBODY MIGHT EAT IT?

OR IS THERE SOMETHING YOU KNOW THAT YOU PUT IN THE PACKAGING TO ALLOW SOME FLAVOR MIGRATION, KIND OF LIKE A WINE, THAT MAYBE A FIVE MONTH OLD JENNI'S MIGHT HAVE EVEN ENHANCED FLAVOR.

IS THAT A THING?

>> OH, ABSOLUTELY.

SO, WE DON'T WANT FLAVOR TO SORT OF EVAPORATE THROUGH THE PINT PACKAGE.

BUT, THE FLAVORS WILL ABSOLUTELY BLOOM IN THE ICE CREAM AS IT AGES.

SORT OF LIKE A WINE OR A CHEESE.

YOU CAN GET MORE PRONOUNCED CINNAMON OR ANY OF THE SORT HARD SPICES WILL ACTUALLY SORT OF MELLOW BUT ACTUALLY WEIRDLY BE A LITTLE STRONGER AFTER A LITTLE WHILE.

SOME INGREDIENTS WILL ACTUALLY SOFTEN, SO WE MAY START WITH A SORT OF CRUMBLIER CAKE ON PURPOSE BECAUSE IT WILL ABSORB THE SUGAR FROM THE ICE CREAM.

THE SUGAR SYRUP, WHICH IS NEVER ACTUALLY FROZEN IN THE ICE CREAM.

IT'S ALWAYS LIQUID.

AND IT WILL GO INTO THE CAKE AND SORT OF SOFTEN IT OVER TIME.

SO, THERE'S ALL SORTS OF REALLY COOL STUFF THAT DOES HAPPEN INSIDE THAT PACKAGE AFTER WE MAKE THAT WE KNOW AND WANT TO HAPPEN.

>> TO YOUR POINT JENNI, THERE'S A LOT OF SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH GOING ON IN THE WORLD OF FOOD PACKAGING.

AND AT THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY, WE CHECKED IN WITH DR. MELVIN PASCALL WHO SAYS THAT PRESERVING FLAVOR IS A UNIQUE AREA OF SCIENCE.

>>> SO, YOUR WORK REVOLVES AROUND NOT JUST FOOD ITSELF, BUT FOOD PACKAGING.

CAN YOU TALK ABOUT PACKAGING AROUND FLAVOR?

>> WELL, MOST PROCESSED FOODS THAT WE SEE IN THE GROCERY STORE THAT WE PURCHASE AND ENJOY ARE PACKAGED.

WITHOUT PACKAGING IN THIS MODERN SOCIETY IN WHICH WE LIVE, OUR LIVES WOULD BE DIFFERENT.

SO, PACKAGING HELPS TO PRESERVE THE FOOD, IT HELPS TO PROTECT THE FOOD, IT HELPS WITH CONVENIENCE BECAUSE WE ARE ABLE TO CARRY THE FOOD WITH US WHERE WE WANT IT BECAUSE OF PACKAGING.

BECAUSE OF PACKAGING WE CAN TELL WHAT'S INSIDE THE PRODUCT.

WE CAN SEE THE LABEL.

WE CAN SEE THE INGREDIENTS.

WE KNOW WHAT WE ARE EATING.

WE KNOW WHAT WE ARE BUYING.

SO, IN A NUTSHELL, PACKAGING IS VERY IMPORTANT IN OUR MODERN SOCIETY.

>> OKAY.

WELL, NOW WE'RE HERE IN YOUR LAB.

WHICH I'M REALLY EXCITED TO BE BACK AT THE BENCH.

TELL US, YOU KNOW, A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE INSTRUMENTS THAT YOU HAVE IN HERE AND WHAT ARE YOU MEASURING WHEN WE TALK ABOUT FLAVOR OR RELATED PACKAGE AND TASTE?

>> WELL, WE MEASURE, FOR EXAMPLE, THE WATER VAPOR TRANSMISSION RATE OF FILM.

AND THIS IS MAINLY PLASTICS.

WITH PLASTICS, WE WANT TO KNOW HOW LONG IT TAKES FOR A CERTAIN QUANTITY OF MOISTURE TO GET INTO THE PACKAGE, TO CAUSE THE PRODUCT TO BE SPOILED, OR TO GET OUT OF THE PACKAGE TO CAUSE THE PRODUCT TO BE DEHYDRATED.

AND, THAT WORKS WITH FLAVORS BECAUSE WHEN WE HAVE A PRODUCT, THE PRODUCT HAS FLAVORS.

SAY FOR EXAMPLE ORANGE JUICE.

THE FLAVORS WILL WANT TO GET OUT OF THE JUICE SO THAT IT CAN BALANCE ITS CONCENTRATION IN THE ENVIRONMENT.

AND WHAT HAPPENS?

THE PACKAGE PREVENTS THAT FROM HAPPENING.

>> SO, THAT'S INTERESTING.

BECAUSE WE LEARN ABOUT THAT IN HIGH SCHOOL CHEMISTRY.

THE IDEA OF OSMOSIS OR DIFFUSION.

GOING FROM HIGH CONCENTRATION TO LOWER CONCENTRATION.

SO, ANY CANNED FOOD OR PACKAGED FOOD, AND YOU TALK ABOUT ORANGE JUICE, THE FLAVOR IF YOU WILL ACTUALLY WANT TO GO THROUGH THE PACKAGE TO BE MORE DILUTE, TO BE MORE BALANCED.

IS THAT CORRECT?

AND THE PACKAGING MAKES THAT INTENSITY STAY THERE?

MAKES THAT CONCENTRATION STAY THERE?

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

THAT'S CORRECT.

YES.

NOW, SOME PLASTICS TEND TO LIKE FLAVORS.

IT MAY WANT TO SUCK THE FLAVORS FROM THE FOOD AND WE CALL THAT FLAVOR SCALPING.

SO, WHEN WE DECIDE TO PACKAGE A PARTICULAR FOOD, WE HAVE TO BE JUDICIOUS.

WE HAVE TO CHOOSE THE RIGHT MATERIAL THAT MINIMIZES FLAVOR SCALPING.

>> HOW DO CONSUMERS DRIVE WHAT'S INSIDE PACKAGING?

>> WELL, ONE OF THE CONSUMER TRENDS THAT WE SEE CURRENTLY IS THAT PEOPLE ARE A LITTLE BIT CONCERNED ABOUT TOO MUCH CHEMICALS IN THE FOOD.

YOU LOOK ON THE LABELS AND SEE A WHOLE LONG LIST OF ALL THESE CHEMICALS.

AND IN THIS MODERN SOCIETY BECAUSE INFORMATION IS SO READILY AVAILABLE VIA THE INTERNET, THE YOUNG PEOPLE IN PARTICULAR THEY WANT TO KNOW WHAT THEY'RE EATING.

AND THEY'RE CONCERNED ABOUT TOO MUCH OF THESE ADDITIVES IN THE FOOD.

>> IS THERE A MOVEMENT TO CREATE NATURAL OR MORE NATURAL PACKAGING SO THE PACKAGING ITSELF CAN NOT JUST NON-HARMFUL, BUT ACTUALLY MAYBE AN ADDITIVE OR EVEN A BENEFIT FROM THE NUTRITIONAL VALUE?

>> AS A MATTER OF FACT, YES.

CURRENTLY IN MY LAB, I HAVE SEVERAL STUDENTS WHO ARE DOING RESEARCH INTO WHAT WE CALL EDIBLE PACKAGING.

>> YOU SAID EDIBLE PACKAGES?

>> EDIBLE PLASTICS.

>> OKAY.

NOW YOU'RE TALKING MY LANGUAGE HERE.

>> AND WE HAVE MADE PLASTICS FROM KOSOVA STARCH.

THAT'S CALLED TAPIOCA.

WE HAVE MADE FROM CHITOSAN.

CHITOSAN IS AN EXTRACT WE GET FROM THE EXOSKELETON FROM SHELLFISH.

WE HAVE ALSO MADE IT FROM MUSHROOMS.

AND THOSE ARE EDIBLE PACKAGING.

YOU CAN EAT IT.

YOU CAN USE IT, SAY FOR EXAMPLE, IN A PIE.

YOU PUT THE EDIBLE FILM TO SEPARATE THE FILLING WHICH IS WET FROM THE CRUST WHICH IS DRY.

BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT THE CRUST TO GET SOGGY.

SO, THAT PUTS MY PRODUCT AHEAD OF MY COMPETITOR BECAUSE MY PRODUCT WILL TASTE BETTER, IT WILL HAVE A BETTER TEXTURE.

AND THERE'S ANOTHER THING WITH PACKAGING.

THERE IS A SUBTLE PSYCHOLOGY WITH PACKAGING.

WE DON'T WANT CONSUMERS TO FOCUS ON THE PACKAGE.

WE WANT THEM TO FOCUS ON THE FOOD.

BUT, WHAT DRAWS THE PEOPLE TO THE FOOD IS THE PACKAGE.

>> HOW IT LOOKS, HOW ITS SHAPED, THE COLOR.

>> THE ODOR.

>> SURE.

>> IF WE CAN MANIPULATE THE ODOR OR HOW IT LOOKS AND STILL GET PEOPLE TO ENJOY THE FOOD WHICH IS WHAT THEY WANT.

PEOPLE DON'T BUY FOOD BECAUSE THEY WANT THE PACKAGE.

THEY BUY THE PACKAGE WITH THE FOOD BECAUSE THEY WANT THE FOOD.

YOU SEE?

IT'S LIKE THE BEE GOES TO THE FLOWER BECAUSE THE BEE IS NOT INTERESTED IN THE PETAL.

THE BEE'S INTERESTED IN THE NECTAR.

>> SURE.

>> WHAT DRAWS THE BEE TO THE NECTAR IS THE FLOWER.

>> INTERESTING.

>> AND THAT'S THE SAME THING WITH PACKAGE.

>> OKAY.

GREAT.

>>> SO JENNI, THIS HAS BEEN TERRIFIC.

WHAT WOULD BE YOUR RECCOMENDATION OR ADVICE FOR PEOPLE WHEN THEY'RE THINKING ABOUT COMBINING FLAVORS?

WHAT SHOULD THEY CONSIDER?

>> WE KNOW THAT PLEASURE IS DERIVED FROM WHAT YOU BELIEVE ABOUT SOMETHING.

SO, STORY AND WHAT YOU BRING TO YOUR ICE CREAM IS REALLY IMPORTANT.

AND I ALWAYS SAY THAT FLAVORS SURROUNDS YOU.

SO, TELL YOUR STORY THROUGH ICE CREAM.

WHATEVER STORIES YOU WANT.

BE CREATIVE IN THAT WAY.

AND THEN JUST REMEMBER THAT INGREDIENTS POP OFF OF ONE ANOTHER.

SO, WHAT YOU COMBINE TOGETHER, KIND OF MAKE SURE THAT THEY HIGHLIGHT EACH OTHER.

WHETHER IT'S SALT AND SWEET.

OR SWEET AND SOUR.

AND THEN THEY REALLY POP OUT.

>> JENNI, SUCH A PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU.

THANKS FOR BEING ON THE SHOW WITH US TODAY.

>> I HAD SO MUCH FUN.

THANK YOU.

DEMONSTRATED.

ìQED WITH DR.B.î JOIN US ON FACEBOOK, INSTAGRAM, AND TWITTER.

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